finn express 83 in Holland

jenne1@chello.nl · Post by **jenne1@chello.nl** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 23:34 pm

Hello i live in Holland and i am the owner of a Finn Express 83 number 130 the year of building is 1981.
I buy this ship in Januari 2015 but nobody have information about this type of ship.
I want to know how i can get the maximum speed out of it ,i already reached 7.5 knts but i want to know if it is possible to go faster and how.
Is this the only Finn Express in Holland? maybe you know it.
Al information is welcome

alex · Post by **alex** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:02 am

jenne1@chello.nl wrote:I want to know how i can get the maximum speed out of it ,i already reached 7.5 knts but i want to know if it is possible to go faster and how.
Is this the only Finn Express in Holland? maybe you know it.
Al information is welcome

Hi and welcome,

Hull speed for FE83 is V=1.34xSQRT(LWL)=1.34xSQRT(22.64)=6.38 kts But of course it could go faster downwind when surfing waves. I have seen 12 kts on my log for short moments and 10 kts for relatively long periods of time.

Most of the FE83 boats are found in Finland and Sweden, I have heard about one boat in Mediterranean.

Regards,
Alex
s/y Subbota

Panu · Post by **Panu** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 14:52 pm

alex wrote: Most of the FE83 boats are found in Finland and Sweden, I have heard about one boat in Mediterranean.

Regards,
Alex
s/y Subbota

Hello

Do you mean the Fe83 at Mediterranean witch sailed at Creege and Turkey at -80's for several years? There was a article about this project at FE magazine mid -80's. That boat was transported to Mediterranean and back by a lorry. I have met this skipper (M. Anttila) at his island just outside of Miessaari.

There was a FE83 in an accident at Portugal some 10 years ago. This boat had achor failure and it ended at the beach of Faro. If I remember right this boat was resgued, but I haven't heard about it afterwards.

Back to the speed issue. The fastest speed I have heard for FE83 is (if I remember right) Charlotta's 14,6 knots at Offshore Week in Helsinki. My record is 11,6 knots with first reef in main and genoa 3 at Espoo GP 2007.

Olli · Post by **Olli** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 22:43 pm

There was one Finn Express for sale in Netherlands about ten years ago. Maybe it's the same one that you own now? I've also heard of one that sailed in Greifswald Germany about five years ago.

Anyway, we don't hear so much about the boats outside Finland and Sweden, so it's very nice to see you on this forum!

Most of us sail on the sheltered waters of Finnish archipelago, and sometimes on other parts of Baltic sea. This means that we never see such wave conditions and tidal currents that you have on the North Sea. You might have a good chance to break the Finn Express speed record some day

If we are only talking about the downwind top speed in heavy wind and huge waves, there's not much to do to get more speed. Of course a good spinnaker and courage to use it in heavier conditions can help. However, if you want to make your boat sail faster in other wind directions too, there are couple of things...

1. The sails are very important. Especially the genoa #1. There's quite a lot of these boats in Finland, and we have one local sailmaker that has done some development work on our class, http://www.wb-sails.fi/en . If you're planning on investing to new sails, it might be a good idea to ask for an offer. They are not the cheapest, but competitive with other european sailmakers.

2. The hull and keel can be optimized. The cast iron keels are usually quite far from optimal. Most of the racing boats have profiled keels. There are good pictures for example here: http://www.fe83.org/gallery/view_album. ... 359&page=1
Unfortunately all the written documentation is encrypted using Finnish language

3. Proper rig trim helps, at least upwind performance. Most of the boats that race, have quite a lot of rake in the mast. About 5 degrees is rather common.

...Anyway, getting to know your boat, and learning to sail faster is the most efficient way to gain speed.

Good luck to your "new" boat, and congratulations. FE83 is a very good choice!

harald · Post by **harald** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 23:35 pm

When traning I'd suggest that you try and match the velocities in the polar diagram, these are derived from an ORC or IMS certificate;

That's about as fast as it gets, if you don't drop the boat that is.

jenne1@chello.nl · Post by **jenne1@chello.nl** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 11:56 am

Thank you for the information
I buy this ship in Januari 2015 when it was for 8 years in a harbour in Holland and it did not get out of the harbour for four years.
I think in Holland i am now the fourth owner,but the first owner was a German and then the ship was called Huetchen.
The ships name now is Finish.
when i bought it it was a wreck and the engine was not ok but after some work i got it alive again.
I am sailing on a little lake in Holland (spiegelplas) and every wednesday we race with 20 - 30 ships of all kinds and it is a fast ship so everybody asks me wat kind of ship is that but nobody knows it,
Maybe next year i can go on the North Sea to break the speed record.
But i have much fun with this ship

Olli · Post by **Olli** » Thu Jul 30, 2015 18:30 pm

The one in Greifswald Germany is probably still there, at least 3 years ago it has been sailing in Boddenetappen. Sailnumber GER 140, name Skania, and skipper Erhard Benz. It would be nice to hear something from that boat too.

jenne1@chello.nl wrote:I am sailing on a little lake in Holland (spiegelplas) and every wednesday we race with 20 - 30 ships of all kinds and it is a fast ship so everybody asks me wat kind of ship is that but nobody knows it

Well, in Finland this is a rather common boat, At least 230 built, and most of them still cruising. The hull shape is rather modern for a boat that has been designed 35 years ago. The mast is relatively low, only 11,5 meters. I've heard that one of the design criterias was that it has to be able to pass most of the bridges in Finnish archipelago. The sail area is not very big, which means that the boat performs best in heavier wind. We often compete with H-boats which is another very common boat in Finland. In the Finnish LYS rating system FE83 and H-boat have the same number. Usually when there's more than 7 m/s wind, it's rather difficult to win a FE83 with any other boat. If there's very light wind, the H-boats are usually faster.

The designer of FE83, Ejvind Still, is one of the top sailboat designers in Finland. You can find a list of his designs here: http://sailboatdata.com/view_designer.a ... ner_id=166 Sunwind Express is a FE83 for Swedish market. Some boats are probably missing from the list, at least Finn26. I think that he's already 80+ years old, but still sailing with his own FE83!

harald · Post by **harald** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 13:38 pm

Some pics added;

Are you using the mast-lowering system to get under a bridge or something?

Protip #1: Arrange for some barberhaulers like so; http://www.fe83.org/wiki/index.php/Spinnuvarustus You will render the downhaul obsolete.

Protip #2: Clean out the chain-box in the stern, and lower and hoist the spinnaker from that instead of the bag.

Protip #3: Order a bag from WB-sails for the spinboom. You can then just stow the boom on the main boom, even without releasing the foreguy.

harald · Post by **harald** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 13:46 pm

Olli wrote: Well, in Finland this is a rather common boat, At least 230 built,

213 is the official number

harald · Post by **harald** » Mon Aug 03, 2015 13:48 pm

If the fourth picture is the state you found the boat in I'm very pleased that you salvaged the boat!

jenne1@chello.nl · Post by **jenne1@chello.nl** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 14:10 pm

Good morning Harald
Thank you for the tips.
I already have barberhaulers now, and when we have a race at wednesday evening i remove the door of the anchorbox,i try that 2 weeks ago and that is the best way to do it i think.
I never have used the system to lower the mast, in Holland we have many bridges that is why many boats in Holland have such a system.
Do you have a picture from the bag to stow away the spi boom i do not understand how it works
Yes on picture number 4 i buy the boat like this on 10 Januari 2015.
It was 4 years in the harbour in Hoorn and it was 8 years ago since it got out of the water and the engine did not work but you can see the result now it is a nice and good looking boat
Regards Jenne

harald · Post by **harald** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 14:36 pm

Very nice boat, congratulations!

The spin-boom-bag is like this;

Olli · Post by **Olli** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 20:14 pm

This model uses the sail groove on the boom. It's very convenient, because you don't need to drill any holes on the boom. Anyway, this might be a problem with some older main sails, because the foot of the sail might not be "flying" like in all new main sails.

However there's also another version of this bag that can be fixed on the side of the boom by screws or rivets.

Petri · Post by **Petri** » Tue Aug 04, 2015 22:29 pm

For some Finn Express-spesific "sailing techniques" you could some of my Gopro-videos uploaded from various races within the past years.
I'm not saying that what we have done is what one should do, but at least you might see some examples of fully amateur yet somewhat experienced crew performing routine maneuvers.

e.g.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JUgwHFSz10
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Whd-wRj-XnA

jenne1@chello.nl · Post by **jenne1@chello.nl** » Wed Aug 05, 2015 12:14 pm

Thanks for all the good information
Nobody in Holland knows this type of ship
A lot of people ask me wath kind of ship is this?
It is sometimes faster then other bigger boats
But i am still learning how to trim it the best way
Regards Jenne

finn express 83 in Holland

finn express 83 in Holland

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Finn Express 83 in Holland

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finn express in Holland

Finn Express 83 in Holland